ELLEN RANSLEY: Anthony Abanese’s chat with Abbie Chatfield could keep him plugged in with voters

For 90 minutes on Wednesday, Anthony Albanese sat down with Abbie Chatfield to talk about his upbringing, finding love again, his achievements as Prime Minister, how Labor and the Coalition differ, and the “dangers” of Peter Dutton.

In the wide-ranging interview on Chatfield’s It’s a Lot podcast, Albanese spruiked Labor’s first-term achievements, trashed the Coalition’s nuclear energy “fantasy” and Dutton’s “hard man” persona, and found common ground with his host over growing up with single mums.

It was the second time this week he’d appeared on a podcast, after spending 40 minutes with the larrakin duo from the Betoota Advocate earlier this week for a chat dominated by the PM’s beloved South Sydney Rabbitohs, and a splattering of discussions of his achievements in this term of Parliament.

In neither case did the PM say anything new or groundbreaking, but that wasn’t the point.

Podcasting has become a vital tool in connecting with voters, especially the cohort who aren’t switched on to the everyday of politics or keeping up with mainstream media.

It was a crucial tool for Donald Trump and Kamala Harris in the US — reaching millions of voters via Joe Rogan and Alex Cooper’s Call Her Daddy in the lead up to the November election.

Dutton was quick to pick up on it earlier this year, jumping on both Olympic diver Sam Fricker’s podcast and Mark Bouris’ show (as did Albanese a week later).

And with this year’s federal election marking the first time millenials and gen Z will together outnumber baby boomers as the dominant voting bloc, speaking straight to younger Australians is crucial for both leaders.

Political marketing expert Andrew Hughes, from the ANU, said the main appeal of a podcast was the opportunity it gave them to be “an authentic, honest, real version of themselves” in a controlled environment.

“The best podcast is when you’re having a conversation with the listener, and the host is somebody asking questions to be like a moderator. You’re talking directly to someone for a long period of time . . . a podcast can do all that heavy work in one go,” he told The Nightly.

“Podcasts help increase likeability towards the leader, and Albanese needs it badly, and he needs it particularly with women, particularly women in the younger age group who will be a very core market of this campaign.

“And what he’s got to try and do is go into areas where the perception is ‘I hate you, I don’t like you, I don’t want you here’, but you go: ‘Okay, I’m not here about that, I’m not trying to win your vote or say Labor is awesome, I’m just going to talk about me, and you can take it or leave it’.

“And I think it’s a strategy to try and get some people back on board that he’s lost, and he needs to get back before the election campaign gets underway.”

Women are sending a message

Chatfield, who rose to fame on the Bachelor before making a name for herself as a podcaster, broadcaster and TV host, has been upfront about her self-described political “bias”.

Her aim, as she repeatedly says, is keeping Dutton out of the Lodge.

She told Albanese to his face she would be voting Greens first, and has acknowledged that on some issues, she doesn’t think Labor is “left enough”.

But, as she has said to her Instagram and TikTok followers as her Albanese interview attracted backlash, this podcast wasn’t aimed at voters who — like her — favour Greens or independents.

“I’m trying to convince undecideds to vote Labor,” she said.

“I’m being practical, I’m being reasonable in saying out of Dutton and Albo, I want Albo.”

This “lesser of two evils” approach crept into the US campaign, and appears to be taken up by the female demographic in Australia who are making their voices heard.

A viral meme campaign, spear headed by TikToker Holly MacAlpine — under the user name hollyunmuted — has begun flooding Dutton’s social media comments.

MacAlpine told The Nightly what was clearly a tongue in cheek joke was emblematic of a broader frustration many young people were feeling.

“It’s a harmless way for women to show their frustration . . . And what people are reading and hearing (about Dutton) is alarming to them,” she said.

In doing so, she’s reaching people who are both tapped into politics, and those who don’t pay it much attention.

“I’m seeing people engage with my funny videos who are then engaging with my content about how preferential voting works,” she said as an example.

While a lot of her content is pro-Greens, the overwhelming vibe is about keeping Dutton out of office — and she said the majority of her engagement is with women who share her views.

Hughes said the cohort of young women would be “one of the most divisive segments in this election”.

Because of that, he suggested it might not be the worst idea for Dutton to sit down with someone like Chatfield — who said she had invited the Opposition Leader onto her show, but that he’d declined.

The benefit of doing that, Hughes says, is “to stretch your brand a bit to show people that you are flexible and can operate in areas or environments where there won’t be a friendly reception for it”.

As Hughes sees it, everyone above 65 tends to skew Coalition, while those under 25 align with Labor, Greens or the teals.

“So, they’re gone, but where the real fight will be over is everyone else in between,” he said.

And to a cohort like young women — who data shows overall appear to be moving to the left — seem to be split down the middle in this election.

One group are career-focused, not yet having kids, who have aspirations of moving up the ladder and making money.

They might be voting Liberal, who Hughes says they are doing “actually quite well with young women aged early 20s to maybe early 40s because of the economic aspiration”, or they might feel motivated by more progressive policies as well as economic aspirations so vote for a teal or Green candidate.

Then there are the women who are having kids and getting married, the ones who are feeling the sting of the cost of childcare and whose household budgets are under pressure.

They more live in outer-suburban mortgage belt areas.

When a demographic is that divided, Hughes says podcasts and social media are the best ways for leaders to make their pitch.

“If I’m a communications person, I want to go to where you’re spending time to influence your behaviour,” he said.

“And hence why podcasts are going to be a place we see a lot more of, because that’s where more of us spend our time,” Hughes said.