Moira Deeming v John Pesutto defamation trial: Audio reveals Pesutto terrified of being connected to neo-Nazis

An excruciatingly uncomfortable conversation between a Liberal backbencher and her bosses has been played in court, revealing Victorian party leader John Pesutto was terrified the Labor government was going to accuse him of connections to neo-Nazis.

On Tuesday a judge heard a recording of MP and women’s rights activist Moira Deeming explaining why she helped organise and attend a Melbourne rally last year where black-clad members of the National Socialist Network turned up and gave Heir Hitler salutes.

“How was I supposed to know that there were Nazis?” she told Pesutto and other senior Liberals in a private meeting after the rally.

“I’m not a mind reader. Maybe there is some secret Nazi salute.”

Mr Deeming is suing Ms Pesutto in the Federal Court for defamation after he expelled her from the parliamentary Liberal Party. Her barrister, Sue Chrysanthou, used the recording to argue Mr Deeming was ambushed and not given a chance to examine the evidence used to justify her expulsion.

With senior party figures, including former prime minister Tony Abbott, supporting the former high school teacher, the case has become a test of whether the Victorian Liberal party can win over wavering voters growing tired of Labor in the progressive state without further alienating its conservative wing.

In the meeting that led to Ms Deeming’s expulsion, Mr Pesutto explained that he was trying to make the Liberal Party attractive to voters of all sexualities, including transgender people.

By opposing transgender rights, and speaking at the rally with a far-right British provocateur known as Posie Parker, she made it impossible for him to take on then-premier Daniel Andrews, Mr Pesutto said.

“People think we walk in lockstep with Nazi protestors,” Mr Pesutto told Ms Deeming. “It’s going to be toxic for us. We will not be able to get any kind of messages up. We will not be able to campaign on anything.”

At the end of the one-hour meeting, Mr Pesutto told Ms Deeming he was going to ask the Liberal MPs to expel her from the party within a week. That process ended up taking two months.

Ms Deeming’s decision to sue Mr Pesutto a year-and-a-half later, drawing attention to the party’s internal differences, may hurt his leadership. A poll last week in The Age suggested the Government and Opposition are roughly even and Mr Pesutto is almost as popular as Premier Jacinta Allan. An election isn’t due for two years.

In the lawsuit, Ms Deeming claims Mr Pesutto accused her of being a neo-Nazi and white supremacist. Mr Pesutto argues he never said Deeming was a Nazi, and she defamed herself by making the claim.

In the recording, Mr Pesutto complains that Ms Deeming’s association with Katherine Deves Morgan, a former federal Liberal candidate from Sydney and transgender critic, made it impossible for him to campaign against the Government because she attracted media attention.

The rally was held outside the Victorian Parliament on March 18. Afterwards, Ms Deeming, Ms Morgan, Posie Parker, whose real name is Kellie-Jay Keen, and Melbourne activist Angie Jones allowed themselves to be filmed celebrating and drinking sparkling wine. Jones wrote on Twitter: “Nazis and women want to get rid of pedo filth, why don’t you?”

Later that day, after Ms Pesutto suggested she resign from the party, Ms Deeming offered to publicly repudiate Nazism and the suggestion of a link between trans-genderism and paedophilia.

“More than happy to condemn all that,” Ms Deeming said on the recording. “I am not arguing. I thought you were going to talk to me about the men in black.”

Mr Pesutto and four other Liberals left the room. They seemed to have concluded, based on their recorded comments, that Ms Deeming was determined to maintain her relationship with the anti-transgender movement, which would damage the party politically.

When they returned, Mr Pesutto said: “I am sorry it come to do this. It is not done personally. I have to put the team first.

“If you wanted to you could resign in the meantime. It would save everyone a whole lot of the energy that goes into these things.”

The hearing is expected to continue for three more weeks.